Why Ken Caminiti?

Why are so many voting to get Caminiti's '96 card in ATG 8? He admitted his MVP season was a result of steroid use. I definitely have sympathy for his other substance abuse problems which eventually caused his untimely death. Then again why should strato be any different than the real mlb where steroid users get an unfair advantage. It should be different though because we know about the steroid use before we put him in ATG8 and can keep those obviously inflated numbers out of the league. Strato is already populated with too many outrageous offensive numbers.

for the stats/card, my friend. I can guarantee the card's pee is clean.


and, not to start another religious war, but, I think that should not matter... both pitchers and hitters were doing it, so, to that extent, it was a level playing field, point being, the stats were as negatively affected by the one as they were by the other.


anyway, w/ Sosa and McGuire and Barry in the player pool, seems disingenuous (to me anyway) to exclude anyone else from the player pool for substances.

and, 2nd anyway, we are playing a nerd's game, not deciding who is in the HOF.

for the stats/card, my friend. I can guarantee the card's pee is clean.


and, not to start another religious war, but, I think that should not matter... both pitchers and hitters were doing it, so, to that extent, it was a level playing field, point being, the stats were as negatively affected by the one as they were by the other.


anyway, w/ Sosa and McGuire and Barry in the player pool, seems disingenuous (to me anyway) to exclude anyone else from the player pool for substances.

and, 2nd anyway, we are playing a nerd's game, not deciding who is in the HOF.

Good points all but still doesn't change my disdain for those who where so obviously helped by it. And I agree Sosa, McGuire and Barry are all a blemish and wouldn't bother me a bit if they weren't in there. True, this is not the HOF. Something about Caminiti, and Anderson for that matter, who never hit 30hr's or drove in 100 runs before or after that really sticks in my craw! But alas, I'm not a fan of DH either so I'm sure I'm in the minority with these cards as well. I have personal rule (to my disadvantage I'm sure) that I never use a player that I know was ever suspected of PED's. So bring 'em on! Just makes it that much sweeter when I win a league championship.

Probably several reasons Ken is getting votes.

A very large percentage of people do not see a problem with PED use.

As noted even among those who do a certain percentage see it as a wash since pitchers were using too.

There are many who do not care about the legitimacy of the stats. They just want the stats. Power hitter at a power position. To me this goes hand in hand with voting for the pre-1900 little league cards.

He probably also gets some votes from Padre fans who just want the option of having that MVP season on their franchise based league. And probably some who do not care about the Padres but do want all the franchises represented with the best season(s) for each position for each franchise.

I voted for Caminiti and Brady Anderson, but I'm not 100% sure I will use them.

I think they belong in the set because these seasons represent important moments in baseball history. The steriod use that promoted each of these does bother me, but I'm inconsistent about this. For example, Norm Cash confessed to using a corked bat during his big 1961 year, but I have no qualms about using Cash.

Weirdly, I have real trouble using Barry Bonds (used him once, I think) but have used Canseco several times, and Canseco is perhaps even harder to defend in terms of his overall behavior than Bonds. Why am I more reluctant to use Bonds than Canseco. I can't really explain it, except maybe to say that Barry's taking the career HR record away from Aaron while on 'roids sort of sticks in my craw.

I can't use any of the Black Sox or Pete Rose either--I have a really hard time with gambling on baseball--but I think their cards belong in the set and I have no problem with other people using them.

All in all, I'm not sure we can expect to completely divorce our feelings about the people the cards represent from the cards themselves. And I don't think we can expect ourselves or our fellow players to be completely consistent, either. Human beings are rarely if ever entirely consistent, and I think that's OK.

I feel better about the Caminiti inclusion than getting another Fred Lynn card.

Nice post Outta Leftfield. I feel much the same way about the issue.

All in all, I'm not sure we can expect to completely divorce our feelings about the people the cards represent from the cards themselves. .

The day I divorce my feelings about the person from the numbers on the card is the day this is no longer fun. In fact, ultimately, it's the only reason to play!!

So we need the Luis Gonzalez "57" card.I assume that would be bulletproof

To me this goes hand in hand with voting for the pre-1900 little league cards.

This.

Nice post Outta Leftfield. I feel much the same way about the issue.

All in all, I'm not sure we can expect to completely divorce our feelings about the people the cards represent from the cards themselves. .

The day I divorce my feelings about the person from the numbers on the card is the day this is no longer fun. In fact, ultimately, it's the only reason to play!!

Thanks!....and I agree with your closing sentiment, too.